How to Rise Above Expectations With Talk Triggers

How to Rise Above Expectations With Talk Triggers

Convince & Convert Founder Jay Baer and Daniel Lemin, Co-Founder of Selectivor, join the Content Experience Show to discuss their new book, Talk Triggers.

In This Episode:

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Full Episode Details

Make the Mundane Remarkable

There are a couple of givens when it comes to marketing: People can only buy your product if they know about it, and the most powerful way to build awareness is through word of mouth.

Businesses are asking, “Can you reliably control and strategize word of mouth?” In their new book Talk Triggers, co-authors Jay Baer and Daniel Lemin explain that not only can you absolutely generate purposeful word of mouth, but you can also strategize the “talk triggers” that will capture the public’s attention.

By finding something about your business that may be mundane and turning it into an interesting, repeatable experience, you can defy expectations and create a powerful talk trigger that will leave your customers dying to tell their friends.

In This Episode

  • Why word of mouth is so important.
  • How to create an effective talk trigger.
  • Why you should strategize your talk triggers.
  • How to avoid being gimmicky.

Quotes From This Episode

“When you take the most boring thing in your business and you make it interesting, it actually stands out more because people expect nothing from it.” — @jaybaer

If it's not a remarkable thing, then people will not talk about it, no matter how grand the gesture is. Click To Tweet

“If you can’t come up with an idea that actually can reach everyone, maybe it’s best to keep looking.” — @daniellemin

Resources

Content Experience Lightning Round

If Oprah was back on air and doing her Favorite Things show, what would you hope to win?

Jay is really into alpacas right now, so he would love to get one from Oprah!

Daniel describes himself as a ferocious traveler, so his dream would be lifetime first class tickets on Singapore Airlines!

If you had a podcast for your own personal interests, what would it be?

Jay has two ideas in mind. First of all, he would love to do a podcast all about tequila! His second idea is one that he’s actually talked about doing with Ann Handley called The Annie Pack, where you can answer questions on the live show for a chance to win a fanny pack filled with goodies!

Daniel would be torn between doing a travel podcast inspired by Anthony Bourdain and doing an interview show similar to Here’s the Thing with Alec Baldwin.

See you next week!

What Great Brands Do That Good Brands Don't in Content Marketing

Okay content is easy. Killer content is hard. This nifty eBook shows you the difference, based on our real-world work with dozens of brands. A must-read!

Episode Transcript

Randy Frisch: Welcome to the Content Experience Show. I am Randy Frisch. I've got Anna Hrach with me. We're going to tell you about a super fun episode that we got to record this past week. Two of our very good friends Jay Baer and Daniel Lemin dropped in to talk about a new book that I'm selfishly excited about, Anna, because it's pink on the cover, as we hit on, and that's thanks to my brand color, which is a case study in this cool book. Anna Hrach: Right. It's not just pink. It's literally Uberflip Pink, and it has alpacas on it. Randy Frisch: It's amazing. They just got us to talk about this without any real story behind it, and that I guess is a talk trigger, which is what this book is called. Anna Hrach: Yeah. For those of you out there who aren't maybe necessarily familiar with talk triggers yet, it is a fantastic strategic way to develop word of mouth stories that will get your customers talking about your business for you. The stats around word of mouth are unbelievable. As Jay walked us through, almost absolutely no one has a strategy for word of mouth today, which is absolutely criminal, yet 83% of American have recommended a product or service to someone else. People are basically talking about your brand, whether you know it or not. Talk Triggers is really going to help you help them tell the right stories. Randy Frisch: What I love about not just the book, but this episode that we got to walk through today, is I think a lot of us sit around in our teams, and as Jay said, we make the biggest mistake. We try and just brainstorm that next big idea, but the real key comes down to having a process, because word of mouth doesn't just happen, or if it does, it's very rare. How do we make this more repeatable? There's a six step process that Daniel really walks us through to help us understand what can we do in our companies to achieve the type of word of mouth that we see with companies like Doubletree. I personally love the Doubletree example. We didn't even dig too deep into it. Anna Hrach: We didn't. It's a great one. Randy Frisch: It is. I actually stayed at a Doubletree Hotel, I think it was only about a year ago. It was one of my kid's hockey tournaments. Their thing there is that they give you warm chocolate chip cookies when you arrive. Let me tell you what happened though. We were there with 20 10-year-old boys playing hockey who just continued to go down to the front desk to get more warm chocolate chip cookies. Anna Hrach: Nice. Randy Frisch: The beauty is the hotel knows that that's what they're there for, right? Anna Hrach: Oh yeah. Randy Frisch: They embrace it. Our kids each had probably six cookies, but what was the cost of that versus my son's brand loyalty now to Doubletree Hotels? It's amazing. Anna Hrach: Right. Any time you go on vacation, he's probably going to say, "Dad, can we stay at the place with the chocolate chip cookies?" Randy Frisch: We were in New York, which I hit on, and we didn't stay at the Doubletree. We were passing. He goes, "Dad, we could've stayed at a Doubletree!" Anna Hrach: Nice. See, word of mouth talk triggers. It really works. You know what always happens too with those cookies is I check in, and I'm like, "You know what? I'm going to not eat this. I'm going to go ahead and be good." Then I'm sitting there in my room, and I'm like, "Oh my God, that chocolate chip cookie looks so freakin' good." Randy Frisch: It is that good. Anna Hrach: Every time, it gets me every time. Randy Frisch: You have to eat it while it's warm, right? Anna Hrach: Yes. Randy Frisch: You wait ... They get you to consume it pretty quickly and be happy. Anyways, let's roll right into this. You got to intro the guys, so we'll hit it with you, Anna. Here we go, this past week's episode. Anna Hrach: Hey, Jay and Daniel, thank you so much for being here today. It is so fantastic to talk to you. Jay Baer: We are psyched to be here. Randy, all our friends out there in Conex land, thanks for having us on the show. Anna Hrach: Daniel, welcome as well. Daniel Lemin: Thank you so much. I think it's my first time here, although I hope it won't be my last. Anna Hrach: Well, it's your first time here, but you actually both have been on Content Pros before. Daniel Lemin: Yes, that is true. Content Pros has a long and illustrious history. Anna Hrach: Yes, yes it does. Randy Frisch: We like to consider it a long family tradition. We just kind of got married, renamed ourselves, [crosstalk 00:04:05], new last name, but we still tell the same stories of our childhood. Jay Baer: It's good talking to you, Randy. I haven't talked to you since our triumphant Conex event in Toronto last month, so it's nice to hear your voice. Randy Frisch: Yeah, I think we were supposed to chat and do a different recording, but I think we both basically lost our voices. Daniel Lemin: Yeah, that's it. Jay Baer: Which is where I am right now, because we're out here talking away, out here hustling the book, baby. We're hustling that new book. We're talking word of mouth. Anna Hrach: Yeah, so speaking of, okay, let's talk about the new book, which is Talk Triggers. It has alpacas on the front, which is amazing. Jay Baer: Courtesy of Daniel. Daniel designed the cover. It is hot pink, and it does have pictures of an alpaca on the front. So if you're like, "Hey, I wonder if that's the right book," it is. There are no other business books with alpacas on the cover. Daniel Lemin: True. Anna Hrach: I mean it's definitely- Randy Frisch: I also like the pink, the pink on the front, great- Jay Baer: I'm glad you mentioned that, Randy, because the reason that the book is pink and the reason it is a very particular shade of pink, someone called it Rubine Red, is that it is the exact same color as the Uberflip corporate color. Why, you might ask? Why, Jay, would you do that? Because there is a tremendous case study in the book, Talk Triggers, about Randy's company Uberflip and their use of word of mouth. Anna Hrach: This podcast just got real meta. Randy Frisch: I know, and that itself is proof that word of mouth ... I remember when Yoav and I chose that color. We're like, "We need something that people will talk about." Orange just wasn't going to do it. CMW owned that, CMI HubSpot ... Jay Baer: HubSpot. Randy Frisch: We were like, yeah, we're like, [crosstalk 00:05:30] "We need something different, [crosstalk 00:05:31] something people will walk by a booth at an event and be like, 'What are those guys up to?'" There you go. Now it's on a book. Daniel Lemin: That's right. We should probably send you a commission fee for using your pink. Randy Frisch: That's already in the agreement, but it's okay. We'll figure it out. Daniel Lemin: Okay, sure enough. Anna Hrach: Okay, so we kind of already jumped into a bit of the Talk Triggers, but Jay and Daniel, would you mind telling us exactly what is a talk trigger, and what is the book about? Jay Baer: It's both simple and incredibly complicated. It's about word of mouth, but which that doesn't sound interesting, because word of mouth has been around for thousands of years, since the first caveman sold a rock to another caveman. Everybody thinks word of mouth is important. Let me just tell you how important it is, though, Anna. Between 50 and 91% of all purchases are influenced by word of mouth. A tremendous amount of all the dollars that you are holding right now have something to do with word of mouth. Here's the part that's a mystery and why this book exists. Nobody has a strategy for it, or very few companies have a strategy for it. You've got a marketing strategy, you got a content strategy, you got a digital strategy, a social strategy, a PR strategy, but nobody has a word of mouth strategy. We just take it for granted. We just assume that our customers will talk about us, but will they? If so, what are they saying? The big mistake that we make is assuming that competency creates conversations, that being a good business is enough to get people to tell the story, but all your competitors are also good, so good enough is not enough when it comes to word of mouth. What you need is something different. That difference is your talk trigger. A talk trigger is a strategic operational differentiator that compels word of mouth. Your customers cannot help themselves. They simply must tell somebody about the pink. They must tell somebody about the Uberflip headband. They must tell somebody about the amazing Conex podcast. Randy Frisch: [inaudible 00:07:20]. I love those. It's funny. I go back to, I talked about events and that we had talked about when people go to an event, and I always remind my team this, it's even if we execute really well at that event, there are 50, sometimes 75 other vendors that are on a trade floor who are all saying, "We are going to knock it out of the park at this event, and people will remember us." I always say, "Well, what's to remember? What's going to be so ... What's that thing that you're going to go back and be like, 'That was something unique.'" Daniel Lemin: A squishy stress ball. That seems to be the choice most people make. Randy Frisch: I was going to say socks these days, but yes, it's either socks or squishy stress balls. Daniel Lemin: Socks have become a thing. Jay Baer: Interesting thing about talk triggers, Anna, sorry, is that the best talk triggers, the ones that create the most conversation are when you take something that is perfunctory and you make it different. Trade show booth is as perfunctory as it gets, but when you do something different, people notice it. The cover of a business book is as perfunctory as it gets, but when you make it pink and put alpacas on it, it creates conversation. What's interesting about this whole idea of word of mouth and doing word of mouth on purpose is that actually when you take the most boring thing in your business and you make it interesting, it actually stands out more, because people expect nothing from it. Anna Hrach: I just think it's interesting too, going off of what everybody's been talking about here is, Jay and Daniel, I know one of the principles of Talk Triggers is basically that same is lame. Going back to the squishy ball and doing the same thing over and over, people are going to talk about you, but maybe not in the ways that you want them to. Giving them something to actually talk about, and Jay, you mentioned taking the most boring thing and making it talkable. It might not be boring to people. It might actually be a differentiator. It's not a squishy ball. Daniel Lemin: One really good example of this, and it's a funny one because it also happens to have the word uber in it, is UberConference. Not for nothing, we actually made a joke about that in the book. The case study about Uberflip and UberConference are in the same chapter, and we thought about calling that the Uber Chapter, or [inaudible 00:09:33] or something very meta, but UberConference, if you have ever been on a UberConference call, you know they've got that really awesome hold music that keeps you entertained during that moment when you join and the call starts. It's so good, in fact, when people get on the call, typically at least one person will say, "That hold music was amazing. Did you hear that? That was so fun." You go on Twitter, search for the UberConference hold music. People talk about it, which is unusual. It's hold music. That's interesting. It's so compelling, in fact, the team at Postmodern Jukebox, you might know them for doing a lot of swing and jazz covers of songs, they remixed that song into a variety of formats, swing and pop and then hip hop. It's pretty compelling. I think we have the link for that on our website, talktriggers.com, but you should go check that out. It's really actually good music. The fun thing about it, it was written by the co-founder of the company. Randy Frisch: That's so cool. I have been on calls, and I have said to myself when the line picks up, "Why did you pick up? I wasn't done with the song." It's that good that it truly does lock you in. Here's my question though, because we were just talking about different Uber companies. No relation to taxis. Having a talk trigger, and ours that you talk about in the book, guys, is the pink headband. I'll admit, we stumbled into that. That was not planned. It kind of just happened, and we embraced it. Whereas I would say with UberConference, not that I know the full story, it seems like they said, "Okay, this is gonna be something unique about us," so I'm wondering, there's two examples there of a company that stumbled in or a company that planned a talk trigger. Have you found that one works better than the other? Is it better to plan for your word of mouth talk trigger, or better to see what develops for the organization? Daniel Lemin: It's much better to plan, because your chances of success are much higher, which is why we have a very specific six-step process that we use in our consulting business at Convince & Convert, and that we have in the book so that everybody can put a successful talk trigger into practice, so it's much better to follow our recipe. However, as a practical matter, many of the examples in the book are exactly what you described, Randy. It's like we just tried a thing and that thing happened to work. Now, could you do that? Yes, but why would you? Why would you just randomly fire off bullets into the air hoping that a bird flies over simultaneously, when we've actually given you a reliable six-step process that we know will work. In fact, Randy, and I should say, this is a good time to mention this, that if listeners go to talktriggers.com/conex, talktriggers.com/conex, they can download the six-step process for free on how to create and develop your own talk trigger. There is of course much more detail in the book itself, but we want everybody to actually do this. We desperately want you to use word of mouth on purpose and well. We want you to grow your business with these principles, so go to talktriggers.com/conex and download that. Randy Frisch: Nice. Maybe you could to tease that out a little bit more, maybe you could give us a couple of those keys that people should focus on that will walk someone through how they would start to approach this mindset of having a talk trigger. Daniel Lemin: There are really four kind of mandates for a talk trigger to work. The first is it has to be remarkable, in the very true sense in the very true definition of that word. If it's not a remarkable thing, then people will not talk about it no matter how grand the gesture is. The second is it has to be relevant to the experience. The reason that that hold music works so well is it's mundane, it's a part of the process that every company has to experience. Every user of a conference call has to experience it, so it's incredibly relevant in that context, in that experience. That's the second. The third is it has to be reasonable. UberConference doesn't give you a personal song every time you log in, just like Doubletree Hotels, one of our other case studies, they give you a cookie when you check into the hotel, they don't give you a baby alpaca waiting in your room upon arrival. It's a reasonable gesture. It's a cookie. It's a hold music feature. Reasonable is the third. Then the fourth one is that it has to be repeatable. If not everyone can have access to that experience, that product, that extra thing, it's going to create dissonance and frustration for people. If you can't come up with an idea that actually can reach everyone, maybe it's best to keep looking. Try to identify some other part of the experience where you can introduce a talk trigger. Anna Hrach: Nice. It really doesn't get much clearer than that, but I want to hear more about some of these examples. Daniel, I know you just mentioned a couple, but let's go ahead and take a super quick break to hear from our sponsors and then when we come back, let's talk about some specific talk triggers and how some of these may have been developed from actual real-life companies. Stick with us and we'll be right back with Jay and Daniel. Randy Frisch: Today's podcast is brought to you by CoSchedule. I am a big fan of the team over at Co-Schedule because they are making it possible for us as marketers to live with an all in one marketing calendar. It combines project management, email marketing, social promotion all in one place, which we know is so tricky when our team is not aligned. To get complete visibility of your entire marketing schedule, keep your sanity, and get more done, check out CoSchedule. You can go to coschedule.com/conex to get your free marketing strategy template, plus a lowdown on how CoSchedule is helping thousands of marketers like you get their sanity back. That's at coschedule.com/conex. Anna Hrach: Growth in your business is tough. Ads are expensive, and let's face it, social media is hard. The best way to grow is to have your customers do it for you via word of mouth. But you have to give people a consistent and memorable story to tell. That story is your talk trigger. Jay and Daniel's new book shows you exactly how to do it. It's "The Complete Guide to Creating Customers with Word of Mouth," and it's available now wherever you get books. It's easy to find because it's the one with the alpacas on the cover and it is Uberflip pink. Visit talktriggers.com/conex to get it today. Randy Frisch: All right, we're back here on Conex and we're chatting about talk triggers with the authors of Talk Triggers, Jay and Daniel. Guys, I've actually been thinking about the two of you a lot lately. I was in New York ... I know, I know. I was in New York with my family a few weeks ago and my wife was like, "We have to go to this restaurant." It's called The Stardust Singing Experience. It's owned by Ellen and basically you go there and the waitresses actually perform Broadway songs during your meal. As we got there, there's a line up down the street and no offense to anyone who works at the restaurant listening to this, the food is shit. It is the worst diner food, and diner food is not hard to nail. But you're not there for the food. Even my wife who's a health nut, she was like, "This is the best thing ever." I thought to myself, "These guys have nailed the talk trigger." They have this experience that is repeatable, that is remarkable. They have a dozen different staff who come through and sing, and I thought, "This is an awesome talk trigger," and realized that that's really what creates that line down the street. Jay Baer: That's it. It's an operational choice. You've got to have ... you have to hire people who can also be a server and can sing. You have to build out ... you have to make sure when they sing they can still get your food out on time. There's a lot of operational things there. What we would say is that that's not marketing. It's not a contest, it's not a coupon, it's not a promotion, it's not that, but it's an operational decision that creates marketing advantages. Now, to take it to the next level, what they should be doing and maybe they are, I don't know, but from a Conex standpoint, what they should be doing is creating content that amplifies that talk trigger. They should be creating a songbook on their website of all the lyrics of all the songs they sing. They should have baseball cards of all the different singers and you can collect them and make sure you sit in everybody's different section. What you want to do, the next level part of this is once you have a differentiator, is you use content to make sure people never forget it. Randy Frisch: I was gonna say the next level is good food to accompany it, but I agree with you. Jay Baer: Well, okay, that's good, but- Randy Frisch: Maybe people are gonna talk more about [crosstalk 00:18:18]. Jay Baer: I'm not a chef, man. I'm just an author. There's only so many things I can help you with. Anna Hrach: I'm also gonna go ahead and take a wild guess about who's never going to sponsor this show. Jay Baer: Anna went to school in Flagstaff, Arizona where I used to live and it's just like Black Barts. There's a restaurant in Flagstaff where we used to live, same idea. Anna Hrach: Singing waiters. Jay Baer: Singing waiters at a steakhouse. It's a family owned business and super successful. I wouldn't say the food is terrible, but it's not the best steakhouse in town. I think that's safe to say, but the same idea. They've got a horse and they ride it. Randy Frisch: I'm curious about the following, talking about you've got your horse, you ride it, you stick with it as long as you can, but I think a lot of us as marketers, we feel as though ideas have a shelf life and we have to move on from them. I'm wondering in what cases you've seen people have to move on from their talk trigger or adapt that talk trigger to more modern days in a way that continues to resonate with their audience. Daniel Lemin: It's an interesting point, because I certainly believe that to be true myself. I think the reality is it's true, things do have a shelf life. The Doubletree cookie example we were talking about, that has been around for more than 30 years. They've had that cookie or something like that experience. I think it actually started out as chocolates as turn-down service, but they'd had that as part of their experience for that long. They have adapted it over time. Now they have a gluten-free cookie, they also have a nut-free cookie in addition to their flagship cookie. They've kind of followed trends. A company that maybe is worth talking about that didn't do that with a potentially very viable talk trigger is Enterprise. Enterprise Car Rental, you may be familiar with their 1980s, 1990s slogan "We'll pick you up." If you ever actually tried to get picked up by the way, it was not necessarily ever the best user experience, but they would technically come pick you up. Randy Frisch: It was terrible, I've done it. It's terrible. Daniel Lemin: It's pretty bad. But in the context of an era now where we have Uber and Lyft and cars pretty much are waiting for us anywhere we go, it's kind of less relevant to get picked up, so they haven't really adapted that to the more modern era to the things that have happened around them, so those externalities to a talk trigger can sometimes give it a shelf life, but there's always ways to adapt it. There's a lot of things we could probably brainstorm Enterprise could do to bring that concept back. Instead, they've just kind of chosen to shelve it. Anna Hrach: In terms of going from obviously sometimes these things can backfire, in order to create a truly genuine successful talk trigger, how do people stay out of the gimmicky territory, and how do they know? Because there's so many times where you could say like, "Oh, this is something we do, maybe let's just enhance a little bit." Or the Enterprise rental thing, that actually was kind of gimmicky. It didn't actually execute well, it was nice in theory but horrible to execute, so how do people stay out of the gimmicky territory? Jay Baer: I think part of it, Anna, is to follow the thesis of the book. The book is organized in a four, five, six fashion so it's four ingredients of a talk trigger, five different types of talk triggers, and then the six-step process. If you really follow the way the book is set up, it will save you from yourself, especially as a marketer because marketers tend to want to make it really big or go viral or do surprise and delight. It's very common now in marketing to say, "Well, attention is hard to come by, there's a lot of competition for attention so what we should do is something really big. We're gonna have a really big thing," and the reality is that often when you go too big it doesn't really work, it creates suspicion, people don't believe it, it's not trustworthy. And so, what you wanna try and do is really remember what we said, that a talk trigger is an operational choice that creates marketing advantages. It's not marketing. So when you think about it that way and say, okay, what could we do every single day that we can still, in theory, do 10 years from now and people will still talk about. When you start to draw that box around your ideas, it tends to keep it in the era of the rational and the realistic and the reasonable, as we would put it in the book. And so, one of the things we like about this process is that if you actually follow it through and you test your triggers and all the things we recommend, it really will spit out the right answer at the back end. We know it to be true. Anna Hrach: I also- Jay Baer: And really, the worst ... I mean we just touched on that. The worst thing that can happen, we see it all the time, is people say, oh great, love the podcast. That sounds like a good idea. We should have a word of mouth generator in our company. Let's all get together in the conference room and brainstorm. That's not the right answer. Because if it was that easy, you'd already have one. And so, the most important part in the whole process, and again go to talktriggers.com/conex to download it, but the most important part is to actually talk to your customers. So, how we do this in practice at Convince And Convert is we interview three sets of customers, new customers, longtime customers, and lost customers, and we say, okay, these are the seven touchpoints we have from you, first call, second call, we give you a proposal, we talk about the proposal, then you sign up, then we send you an invoice, whatever. And for each of those seven things, we ask the customers, what did you expect would happen at each of those points? Because once you know what customers expect, you know what they don't expect. And that delta, the difference between what they expect and what they don't expect, that's where your talk trigger lives. So for example, if you're in a B to B circumstance, as Randy is, as we are at Convince And Convert, typically you just send somebody a PDF of the proposal. They might tell you in the interview, well what I expect is that you'll email me a PDF of your proposal. Well now you know what they expect. So what if instead, you sent a sheet cake, and the sheet cake had the cover of the proposal on it, and then the proposal itself was printed out, and it was in a laminate underneath the cake, so the client has to eat the entire cake to get the proposal. That's a talk trigger. The only way you get that, it's not by sitting in a conference room. It's by understanding what customers expect, and then doing something they don't expect. Daniel Lemin: I want that sheet cake so bad now. Randy Frisch: I know. I'm just like I haven't been, I mean it kind of starts to also veer in our world of B to B, as you hit on into this whole ABN, [inaudible 00:24:34] I think the interesting question, because I know Daniel, you said earlier, it's not about personalizing to every person, but I wonder how that's going to morph some of these Talk Triggers that we see. This idea of I go to a hotel and what's that experience look like for me, or I go to a restaurant, if we have all these personalized experiences literally one to one, how are those going to be replicated in a meeting to weigh in? I think that's something exciting to look forward to. Daniel Lemin: You know, and it's true, it's possible that your talk trigger could be that you personalize everything for every person. Operationally, for most businesses, that's not exactly scalable, but it could be in some cases for a smaller, a smaller boutique consulting firm or accounting firm, something like that. It's possible, but that is a talk trigger, so all things can work. Randy Frisch: Absolutely. All right, before we take a short break, and just get to know everyone on this podcast a little bit more, as we like to do at the end, maybe we can make sure that people know where to go get all the assets tied to this book, including the book itself. Jay, can you help us with that? Jay Baer: You can get the book in all the places and ways that books can be procured. You can get it online of course, you can get it in all your offline book stores as of the first of October. It's in all the airport book stores as well. You can get the Kindle version. You can get the audio version, which is read by Daniel and myself, so you definitely can't miss it. Again, if you see Alpacas, it's the right book. If you go to talktriggers.com/conex, not only can you get the free six step process guide, but a bunch of other free materials, all kinds of bonus stuff, research, presentations, book clubs, study guides, all the stuff that's not actually in the cover, in between the covers of the real book, but all kinds of free stuff for you there at talktriggers.com/conex. Randy Frisch: Awesome. All right guys, let's stick around, and if you have time, we'll get to know the two of you a little bit more behind the scenes right here on the Conex Show. Anna Hrach: All right, welcome back everybody. Now that we've gotten to know Jay and Daniel on the professional side and the talk trigger side, let's get to know them a little bit better on the personal side. So Jay and Daniel, you have this amazing stat in the book that basically says, celebrities have virtually zero influence on purchasing decisions from consumers, is that correct? Daniel Lemin: It's true. Jay Baer: Yeah, it's remarkable how much business, time, money, effort we put into courting celebrities, but their ability to drive actual purchases is minimal. Anna Hrach: Except for Oprah. Jay Baer: Oprah is number one. Far and away the most influential celebrity. Anna Hrach: Which is crazy. Okay so, if you happen to, let's say Oprah was back on air and doing her Favorite Things show, what would you just so hope to win in Oprah's favorite things? Like if she were like, everybody gets a blank, what would you want that to be? Jay Baer: Well, I mean right now it obviously be an Alpaca. If it was like everybody wins an actual Alpaca, I'd be like hell yeah. I wanna lead and a bale of hay and all is right with the world. So yes, clearly Alpaca, obviously. Daniel Lemin: And we know some people who could make that happen actually, Jay and myself, we've spent some time with Alpacas. Randy Frisch: It really rolls off the tongue, you get an Alpaca, you get an Alpaca. [crosstalk 00:27:51]. I don't know how many times you could say that, it becomes a bit of a tongue twister. [crosstalk 00:27:55] Jay Baer: As Daniel said, we've shot some videos of Alpacas for both promotions, and [inaudible 00:28:01]. Randy Frisch: All right, you're not getting out of this question easily. You can't both say the Alpaca, so one of you can go with Alpaca. Jay Baer: Okay then, Daniel can answer something different. Daniel Lemin: I mean I'm a travel, ferocious traveler, so it would be something travel related, like lifetime first class tickets on Singapore Airlines. I would take that. Anna Hrach: Lifetime? Daniel Lemin: Yeah, and the sky couch. We have a case study in the book, in the talkable useful section about Air New Zealand and their sky couch, which is a seating arrangement you can get on the plane that turns into a futon, so you can hang out with the kids or play cards or cuddle or snuggle or whatever, so yeah, lifetime sky couch would be alright too. Anna Hrach: I like that. [crosstalk 00:28:45] Randy Frisch: This was a great question. We're gonna have to use this one again. I don't know, I was just gonna ask them something boring about podcasting, but this is- Daniel Lemin: All right, go for it. I know something about podcasting. Randy Frisch: Oh yeah, all right. We'll finish on this one then. We know both of you are on podcasts. Jay, you've go Social Pros, which is a huge success. What if you were not doing this for work purposes though? If you had a podcast tied to a personal interest, I feel like I know your answer, but what would that personal interest that you would dig into and have guests who were expert on that area for your own personal selfishness? What would that look like? Jay Baer: I love this question so much. I would go with two. I would definitely do a tequila review show. Randy Frisch: That was my guess, okay. Jay Baer: But I actually have really thought through doing a show with my very good friend, Mike Corak, who is the General Manager of the DAC Group, digital agency, and he and I are best friends and we just kind of hang out, and so we really concepted this whole show, which is basically Jay and Mike just talk shit. We just have no agenda. We just turn on the microphones and ramble, which sounds like some of the comedy podcasts out there. So that would be one, but my real answer is that Ann Handly and I have talked about doing a show together for a long time. A Facebook live show called the Annie Pack, and the way it works is we just ask a marketing questions and trivia, and if you get the question right, we send you a fanny pack filled with random stuff. Randy Frisch: That's amazing. It sounds like the mystery box that we saw- Jay Baer: Yes, the mystery box, the mystery fanny pack. So, that may actually happen next year. I might get ... after the book's done, I may actually end up doing that show with Ann, so we'll let you know. Randy Frisch: Nice. All right, over to you Daniel. If you were to do a podcast about a personal area of interest, what would the topic be? Daniel Lemin: I'd be torn. On the one hand, it would maybe be something travel related, and I'd have to think through format on that, but probably something travel related, sort of Anthony Bourdain inspired, but podcasty. I love food. I love travel, and those fit together quite nicely. But I'm also a big fan of ... if you've ever listened to Here's The Thing, with Alec Baldwin, I don't think it's on air anymore, but it was a WNYC Studios podcast in New York, NPR Studios podcast, super fantastic. He talked to nuclear scientists, Jerry Seinfeld, David Letterman, just people from all stripes about their areas of expertise, and the thing about that podcast that was so great was his voice and the way he drew out stories for people. The one, where he talked to the nuclear engineer was mind blowingly good. So, it might be something like that too. Anna Hrach: All right, well there you have it. So, sky couches and amazing stories about just people in general, nuclear physicists or engineers- Jay Baer: Alpacas. Anna Hrach: Alpacas, all the Alpacas, all right, well Jay and Daniel, we are unfortunately at the end of our podcast here today, but thank you so much for joining us. It was so fantastic to have you on again and talk about Talk Triggers. One more time, let's remind everybody where they can get that book. Jay Baer: Talktriggers.com/conex. Anna Hrach: Fantastic. All right everybody, thank you so much for joining us today. We will talk to you next week. Go ahead, do us a favor, leave us a review, tell us what you like to hear from the show. We love to hear feedback and comments. Until next week, I'm Anna Hrach from Convince And Convert, and this has been Randy Frish from Uber Flip, and we will talk to you soon. PART 3 OF 3 ENDS [00:32:22]  
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