Why Content Experience Is the Backbone of Marketing

Why Content Experience Is the Backbone of Marketing

Zontee Hou of Convince & Convert and Daniel Sendecki of Uberflip join the Content Experience Show to discuss a holistic content experience and Conex 2018.

In This Episode:

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The Next Step

The term “content experience” seems to be working its way into conversations in favor of “content marketing.” While some may view this as a matter of semantics, the two terms actually represent a fundamental difference in viewpoints.

It is no longer effective to view content as its own corner of your marketing strategy. Content has become the central pillar of effective marketing and should be supporting the customer’s overall experience.

Whatever facet of your business a customer engages, they should be having a smooth and unified experience. By moving past the old model of content marketing and focusing on a high-quality content experience, your business can truly begin to step into the future of marketing.

In This Episode

  • How the Uberflip Experience became Conex.
  • How to balance value for the audience with value for the customer when presenting a conference.
  • Why content is no longer a standalone solution but the backbone of marketing.
  • What speakers to watch for at Conex 2018.
  • Why there is no distinction between a B2B and a B2C content experience.

Quotes From This Episode

“As content marketers, we are always having to balance the value that we bring to our audience with the value that we bring to our company.” — @ZonteeHou

What we're used to on the consumer side is the kind of quality that we have to deliver on the B2B side. Click To Tweet

Resources

Content Experience Lightning Round

Who is everyone excited to see at Conex 2018?

Zontee is very excited about Amy Landino because she always has something fun and practical to say.

Dan is looking forward to his hometown favorite, Scott Stratten.

Anna can’t wait to see Omar Johnson speak in person for the first time.

Randy is most excited for Corinne Sklar to hear how she and her team create great experiences at scale.

See you next week!

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Episode Transcript

 
Anna: Hey everybody, welcome to the Content Experience Show. So excited to have you here today. You're gonna see, today's a little bit different. I'm here with the ever amazing Randy from Uberflip. Randy, what did you think of today's episode? Do you want to give everybody a little preview on what's different today?
Randy: Yeah, absolutely. When we started doing this podcast, you and I together that is, and we changed the name to Conex, that was Jay Baer and I talking about making Conex much more of a movement. We've been working on doing that, and getting people to realize that creating content's not enough. We have to think about how it all comes together. But, Jay and I had said, this is about having a TEDx movement, where you've got the podcast, but you can also come to the event and see all those speakers. Today what we want to do is make sure everyone who tunes into this podcast knows that there's an opportunity to come and meet with other people who feel the same way, and get a little bit of an understanding of how that all came together, as well as some of the speakers who we have.
I thought this was a fun podcast just for marketers, talking about what type of events they get excited about and why.
Anna: Yeah, totally. We don't just talk about the conference on this episode either. For those of you who are not attending or unable to attend, don't worry, there's still a ton of great, fantastic information in here. At one point Zontee ,who is part of the Convince and Convert team, she drops the mic and we all just have this whoa, Keanu Reeves Matrix moment. It's really good. There's just a lot of great stuff in here in general. We do talk about speakers, but of course if you're listening to this after the conference, there's always ways to see who we've been talking about via recordings.
Randy: Absolutely. For those who have no interest in conferences at all but just want to know all about Toronto, which is my great hometown, there's a great little talk at the end about the best things about Toronto, which yeah, I think should entertain anyone, even if you're not into content experience, which of course you are. Onwards from here and let's roll the episode, 'cause it's just fun time, four marketers talking about what they like to hear.
Anna: Hey everybody, welcome to the Content Experience Show. We're doing something slightly different today. We actually have not one, but two guests joining Randy and myself today. First off, we have Zontee from Convince and Convert. Zontee, thank you so much for joining us today. It is so great to have you here.
Zontee: Really excited to be on the show. Looking forward to it.
Anna: Yes. We are so excited to chat with you. In addition, we also have Dan from Uberflip. Dan, it's so great to have you as well.
Dan: Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to it.
Anna: Fantastic. The reason why we have two people from Convince and Convert, and two people from Uberflip here today is because we're gonna be talking about the Conex, The Content Experience Conference coming up this August.
Now this is a joint partnership between Uberflip, and Convince and Convert. We wanted to just take some time to chat about it and give a little preview on some of the topics you can expect, some of the speakers that you're gonna see, and then also just talk about why we've made this massive shift towards the content experience to begin with, and why we actually took this podcast even and changed it from Content Pros to the Content Experience Show.
In order to kick us off and explain the Content Experience, Randy and Dan, this initiative started at Uberflip. Would you mind telling us the origins of the Content Experience and the Conex Conference?
Randy: Sure thing, Anna. First of all, like this podcast, the event was not originally called Conex. In fact, it wasn't even called Content Experience. If you go back three plus years ago, my Co-Founder Yoav and I, we said, "You know what, it's time to start bringing together our own user base."
Year one, just taking you through quickly, it was called the Uberflip Experience. It was great and we still tried to keep it pretty pure on stage. It was the year afterwards that someone said to me, "I loved you conference but I didn't really learn a lot about your solution there." I thought to myself, "Well, that was the point." We wanted to keep it pure, we wanted to keep it all about thought leadership, and ways to execute your marketing at that next level. The person said, "Oh, that's cool, but I thought it was more of a pure user conference." I was like, "Well, of course you would think that because we called it the Uberflip Experience."
We looked at that, the same lens and said, "Well there's probably a lot of people who wouldn't even bother coming because they think it's gonna be just how to use our platform." When reality was, we had amazing speakers talking about how to take your content and how to take your marketing strategy to that next level.
We had that moment of Jerry Maguire if you will, where we said, "Okay, well we're gonna change this all up." Dropped Uberflip, created some much more strict guidelines that Dan has to help enforce here, where the idea was we're gonna create a movement, not a user conference. Dan joined us last year. I think it was just after I had pissed everyone on our team quite a bit off by saying, "We're gonna change all the branding," and everything like that. You were in that meeting, Dan.
Dan: Oh, that was my first week, I think.
Randy: Yeah. I was like, "Now that we have a new guy, you can't say no to me."
Anna: Dan didn't flip tables on his first week in the conference room?
Dan: I was a little concerned because of the timing, but really the opportunity there I embraced. I thought it was an excellent opportunity for us to take what was a user conference and make it more industry led. For somebody who was looking to build out the brand and grasp my role, or hold onto that role, it was a perfect opportunity.
Anna: I also love that ... One, I love your optimism, Dan. I think that's amazing. But also, two, I love that you had the exact opposite problem as some conferences where somebody was actually like, "Hey, Randy. I was expecting this to be all about your product  but I actually got a ton of value out of this, and it was actually really awesome, and educational, and informative. You didn't plug your brand." Versus, Zontee, how many times have you even seen a webinar or something, where it's been sponsored, and you have to sit through a 45 minute intro about the product?
Zontee: Yeah, I think that's true. We, as content marketers, are always having to balance the value that we bring to our audience with the branding and the value that we bring to our company. I think that the delicate balance really is all about making sure that the audience comes to the table and says, "I learned something. I got true information out of this that I can take back to my own team." I think that's something that's really important in creating a really great event that has a good balance of different kinds of tracks, different opportunities to learn, and an experience that's worthwhile for people to come back to year after year.
Anna: Totally. It seems like that's the key to really any even, any conference, any sort of educational component. Randy, it sounds like you guys really achieved that pretty easily. How did you then take it from the Uberflip Experience, to the Content Experience?
Randy: That was more of a branding choice, like Dan said. I didn't give people a lot of time to chew on it because it was one of those situations where well, if we're gonna do this, we should have done it three weeks ago. We're either gonna do it or we're not gonna do it. We were a little stressed at the beginning that Content Experience was the long term, but we had been building that as our movement in the company already, on the industry that we want people to realize it is so important.
The short term for where it came out of the conference's past year where we had a much larger attendance [inaudible 00:08:38] people who were not just Uberflip users. Then it was actually Jay Baer who as many people who listens podcast know is very much behind Convince and Convert, has his own podcast, Social Pros. Jay had keynoted the event two years in a row. Right after the event, he shot me a nice message saying, "Listen, this thing's becoming really big. It's been a much bigger idea and what if we partnered and took a lot of the properties that we have together," including the podcast that we're on right now, "and really put forward a joint effort to build content experiences that that next category that a lot of us can realize is the next step of content marketing."
Anna: Yeah. I know especially Zontee and I work together quite a bit at Convince and Convert. We partner up together on our clients and we constantly talk about the experience that our clients are providing to their customers. I mean, Zontee, I feel like that's pretty much almost the root of every conversation, even before we really got involved with the Content Experience Conference. It really felt like that's the root of all of the conversations we've been having over the last year or two.
Zontee: Yeah. What I like about this term content experience is that it gets at this idea that content marketing is actually a really holistic part of the way we approach marketing in general. As we talk to both B2B and B2C brands about building strategies across their digital marketing practices, and you work on the consulting team that I co-lead, obviously this is the kind of conversation that we have with our clients every day, is how do we bring a holistic, robust and cross-pollinating environment in which we are creating all of our different digital efforts?
Content marketing, I think, has to be the backbone of everything else that we do. But it isn't a stand-alone thing anymore. In fact, the lines of where content is versus marketing automation, versus creating podcasts, versus social media, all of those things are one pursuit. I think that one of the great things about how we approach this name Content Experience, is that it gives you that sense of that bigger space that we're in.
Anna: Totally. Randy, I know we've had those conversations on the podcast a lot too.
Randy: Absolutely. It's funny. I'm sitting here with Dan. Dan, so many times you's said to me in our office. Just so everyone has context, when Dan's not running Conex as the event and pulling everything together, which is pretty much a full time job, so when you're dealing with your other full-time job here, which is managing all of our creative services, I think you've said to me, literally everything we do has a content element, which I think play so much into Zontee's point. Maybe you can give some of those examples throughout our journey where content's not just an inbound activity.
Dan: Yeah. One of the points that Zontee brought up that I found is really germane to the conference was how expansive that this is. Also set against the fact that the conference itself is single track, but appeals to more than just brand people or content marketers, or demand generation people. It really truly is expansive.
To Randy's point, no more important, what's the most important thing to a person who's concentrating on brand holistically through all creative services. On one hand you have this really expansive scope of a conference with a single track and it's very important to stay with a very narrow focus, but appeal to as many disciplines as possible. I think holistically, that's a great description of what a brand is.
Randy: I love that. We're gonna take a short break here on the podcast, then maybe what we'll do is we'll share with all of you which of the speakers for Conex we're most excited for, and why. We've each got about two minutes while we listen to these sponsors to think about them. You can check out who those speakers are at Conex.Uberflip.com, in the meantime.
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Jay Baer: Hey friends, it's Jay Baer. Imagine experiencing all the awesome that is Conex but live. Everything you love about this podcast, but for two days in three dimensions, in a beautiful theater in Toronto. This year, August, you're gonna hear from the best speakers about content marketing at Conex, a truly intimate networking experience with 750 marketers. I'm the Co-Producer of this event, organized by my friends at Uberflip. We're gonna bring together brilliant strategists and brand marketers from all over the industry, in Toronto. It's August 20th thru the 22nd. Every single session is a keynote. The speakers have been handpicked by me. They include Andrew Davis, Scott Stratten, Tamsen Webster, Amy Landino, and leaders from DocuSign, 3M, Bluewolf, Pardot and more. Get your ticket today at Conex.Uberflip.com. That's Conex.Uberflip.com. Use the promo code PODCAST to save $50 off your ticket. I will see you in Toronto.
Randy: All right, now. As promised, we're gonna tell you about each of our favorite hyped up speakers for Conex. Just so you have the dates, this is August 20th to 22nd in Toronto. If you're listening to this podcast after, I assure you, you can find a lot of these recorded segments at Conex.Uberflip.com. But for now, I'm going to turn first to Zontee. 'Cause Zontee, I want to know who you're most pumped to come see at Conex.
Zontee: You guys have a ton of great speakers on the roster this year, but I think that the speaker that I'm really excited to see right now is Amy Landino, formerly known as Amy Schmittauer. If you're not familiar with her, her book is Vlog Like A Boss. She has an amazing YouTube channel that's all about creating content and all about how to do great video content. What I like about her approach is she has great resources for small and medium businesses, as well as working with a lot of larger brands. She's really bringing to the table this breadth of experience in terms of practicality, and also creativity.
I love that she has a very fresh, polished approach to telling stories and giving you really usable information. I always feel like when I see her speak somewhere, I walk away going, "That was something that I'm definitely gonna take back to my client and be able to start using." I think that's so important when you go to these events, is to go to speakers who not only inspire you, but give you specific information that allows you to build an action plan with your team when you go home.
Anna: Agreed. She was just on the podcast too, on July 2nd.
Randy: I know. It's such a good linked piece of content that you just created here, Zontee, for us. Thank you for that.
Anna: That wasn't even planned.
Randy: I know. That was natural. All right, so who's up next here? I feel like we should jump back and forth between Convince and Convert, and Uberflip. Dan, you're up next. You've pretty much helped handpick this lineup. You're gonna offend someone with your choice.
Dan: Not to compare speakers to children, but it's like [crosstalk 00:17:18] when somebody ...
Randy: Right. Who's your favorite child?
Dan: Exactly. When somebody asks you who your favorite child is. You know, I'm gonna have to go with hometown favorite, and that's Scott Stratten. He's Canadian out of Oakville, which is in the greater Toronto area. I first saw him speak at Content Marketing World a few years ago. At that point in time, his talk track was The QR Codes Kill Kittens. I really liked how he pointed out the absurdity of day to day marketing, and how marketers really should take a step back and consider what they're doing in light of everything. He underlined it with the notion of receiving a QR code in email, and wondering what you're supposed to do with it.
Randy: That's kind of silly.
Dan: I'm really looking forward to him talking about how everything has changed and nothing is different. Bringing that focus on trust, and connection, and authenticity, and what it means to brands and organizations in today's climate. I think he's got some important things to say about that.
Randy: Nice. His will be I guess, an un-keynote, as he would say.
Dan: An un-keynote.
Randy: For those who don't know Scott Stratten, he's built this brand around the term un. I think he actually has an UnPodcast.
Dan: Yeah, on marketing. Yup.
Randy: Awesome. All right, Anna. You haven't spoken in a while, so why don't we just let you talk about your favorite keynote.
Anna: I am really excited ... In addition to everybody that was mentioned, I am really excited to see Omar Johnson. I have actually never seen him speak, but I do know that he is he former CMO at Beats by Dre, and the former VP of Marketing at Apple. Whenever I get a chance to potentially get a sneak peek behind the doors at Apple and how they operate, I am super excited. Apple and Walt Disney are my favorite companies to learn about because of just the way that they do things, and the level of polish and detail that they provide and produce consistently. I honestly don't even know what he's gonna be speaking about. I hope it's something related to that, but it could be something totally different and awesome. But I'm just really excited to see him, just with that background. Especially working on those massive, massive global brands. It'll be really cool to see.
Randy: That's [inaudible 00:19:30]. Yeah, I think it's that they both create amazing experiences, right? That's what you probably love about those brands that Disney and Apple. I'm just gonna say though, great choice in Omar, but you've just taken a huge career risk by not saying Jay Baer. I don't know. I mean, both of you. You both had that opportunity, Zontee and Anna, to say, "I can't wait to see Jay speak."
Anna: Hey, Randy. Remember that time we recorded the podcast and you threw us under the bus? Oh wait, that's right now. Oh, that just happened. Of course we're excited to see Jay. Okay, also, Dan didn't say you. You're talking.
Randy: That's all good. That's all good. I can handle it. I mean, we'll see. I always look forward to Jay's texts to me on a Saturday afternoon where he's just catching up. He's gonna be like, "What the hell is going on the podcast?" It's okay. We'll move forward. We'll move forward. I feel like I should talk about my favorites. I have three kids, so usually I would drop three things that I like about each of my kids, but I'm gonna try and limit myself to one. Maybe I'll have to drop two here.
First of all, a large number of people who do come to Conex have an interest in not just consumer examples, which we've talked about. Everyone now knows we've got people like Omar Johnson coming from a consumer world. But also B2B, I feel like I have got to drop some B2B content that we've got. One of the people I'm really excited about coming out to the event is Corinne Sklar. Corinne is the CEO at Bluewolf. If you don't know the Bluewolf story, they were acquired by IBM, and they basically run Salesforce implementation and scale. Corinne's been there for ages, works with some of the largest brands in the world figuring out how they go to market, and how they create experiences at scale. I think that's something that all of us these days are really trying to figure out.
As much as I say that's the one that I'm professionally intrigued by, I'm gonna throw a bonus one in, and that is Matthew Luhn. If you don't know the name Matthew Luhn, let me know if anyone doesn't know Monster's, Inc., Toy Story, The Incredibles, Finding Nemo, Ratatouille. Matthew was one of the story tellers at Pixar, who helped pull all of those storylines together. I think what all of us love about all of those is ... First of all, when does Pixar ever fail? It's because they think about creating this immersive experience. You hit on it earlier when you were talking about loving the brand that Disney is. They pull us in, they suck us in. It's not just the characters, it's how they all tie in together. I personally can't wait to hear that type of ... the lessons that got over the years working there and pulling together some of those storylines.
Anna: I'm also gonna need to have just a really quick conversation with him about how the first five minutes of Up makes me weep like a baby.
Randy: It's so true. My team often, I think, associates me. Anna, you've gotten to know this about me, that I'm very easily distracted. Sometimes I'll just be like, "squirrel".
Dan: [inaudible 00:22:53] really interesting thing here with speakers like Omar Johnson, and Matthew Luhn. Here is the natural equation is, what we're used to on the consumer side is the kind of quality that we have to deliver on the B2B side. You start to see the stories that we tell on the consumer side are too different from those, with the B2B organizations.
Anna: No. I agree. Zontee, chime in. You and I both work with a ton of B2B and B2C. It really feels like when we talk about the content experience, there is no such thing as the B2B content experience and the B2C content experience. It really is just about creating the best experience as possible. The distinction between the two feels like that line is fading really quickly.
Zontee: I think that you bring up a really good point. One of the things that I say to clients and workshop attendees all the time is that you have to think about the fact that the B2C experience is impacting our B2B client because of course in other areas of their life, they are that person. We're not divided in terms of how we experience the world at large. Of course, somebody who loves Disney is gonna go into their office and then have to purchase software, or technology, or HR services. In all of those cases they are really expecting the brand experiences to be as strong, and to be compelling to them in the same ways. Now that doesn't mean that you need to use those same tools in order to communicate to your B2B client, but it certainly means that you have a very high bar, or a high threshold to cross.
Randy: We're all just like, "Fuck that was good." Every time, once in a while we have to edit some of those awkward silences, I think that was one of the ones we we're like, "Yeah. That says it all."
Anna: Yeah. That's just gonna stay in, 'cause everybody I think took a collective like, "wow".
Randy: Nice. I'm gonna throw a bonus question. We're not gonna do a break this time. Usually we do a little break before we do the get to know you thing. I'll tell ... This time Dan and I will each tell people top things to be excited to come see in Toronto, because that's where this conference is. But maybe for Zontee and Anna, you can tell us the things that you're most excited to experience in Toronto, aside of the conference.
Anna, I'm putting you on the pressure cooker. You're first.
Anna: Okay. I am going first. Well I have been to Toronto before, and I loved it. I'm just excited to go back and see the things I didn't get to see before. Obviously the conference, I'm excited to see. But then in addition to that, just Toronto in general. Everything, I love it. I love the culture, the people, the city, the beer, the food. It's just a cool city to be in and hang out in for a week. It's awesome. I love Toronto.
Zontee: I have not been back to Toronto since I was a teenage, but one of my very good friends lives there and gave me a heads-up that the Canadian National Exhibition is happening. It sounded like a place where I can eat all kinds of crazy foods in one spot, and go on different amusement park rides. Now that sounds to me like something I can't pass up. You guys are the locals, tell me if I'm correct.
Randy: You're right. Not just that. The Ex starts, I think, around August 18th to September 4th. It's this fair to a whole other level. We were actually kidding about it earlier today that we've got Conex, and then we also have The Ex, 'cause that's what it's known as, The Ex. It comes to the city and it's actually just down the street from our office. For those who are coming for the Convince and Convert Pre-Conference, which is the day before, at our offices, where Jay and team are gonna lead a whole bunch of strategy sessions, if you don't like the food that we're gonna serve, which is amazing, you can actually walk down the street I think what, Dan, like seven minute walk? Sneak in and you can eat crazy stuff, like deep fried Mars bars and all sorts of wild food. It's pretty epic.
Zontee: You're telling me that that's where you're gonna find me during the breaks during the event.
Randy: Exactly. It's gonna be, "Up next, speaking on content strategy is Zontee, nowhere to be found."
Dan: She's having a Krispy Kreme donut with a hamburger in the middle of it.
Randy: Yeah. All right, Dan ...
Zontee: I will bring back crazy treats for everybody.
Randy: Dan, what else would you point to that people should be excited about in our great city of Toronto?
Dan: For me, Toronto is a city of neighborhoods. I just think of some of my favorite summer experiences are walking up Spadina and exploring like Kensington Market, and the thrift shops in there, and grabbing lunch. Really, you can find that all over Toronto. But for me, one of the defining places is Kensington.
Randy: Yeah, Kensington is cool. It's got a very different vibe. It embraces the cultural diversity of the city in many ways.
All right, I'm not gonna set expectations high. I'm just gonna tell people though, on my side. This isn't essentially what I like. I actually like to get away from this when it happens, but it's pretty cool.
A week or so after Conex, in the city, is TIFF, which is the Toronto International Film Festival. Our conference is literally right down the street from the heart of TIFF, where all the stars stay at the fancy hotels and things like that. A lot of the time, because the city is so great, people actually come in early. No promises but as you wander around for Conex, don't be shocked if you run into like a Brad Pitt.
Dan: Actually, we were doing a site check the Intercontinental Hotel for Conex, and this was several months ago. We ran into Kurt Russell in the lobby as we were just walking around.
Randy: There you go. Kurt Russell. Goldie Hawn Kurt Russell? Are they still together?
Dan: Yup. I think so. And they actually have a place north of Toronto.
Randy: There you go. There you go. No promise that these are the people you're gonna run into, but at the very least, you're gonna see Omar Johnson.
Anna: Totally gonna start making promises to people that they're gonna see Kurt Russell, because I just want it to happen. It's got to be, you put it out there and it's gonna happen. I just want to see Kurt Russell.
Randy: It literally happens in the city in those weeks. I'll be out with my wife somewhere and all of a sudden there's some sort of star at the table next to us, out for dinner in those weeks [inaudible 00:29:48].
Dan: I've had a couple close calls with Ethan Hawke, and being in the same place. Maybe some of the cast form Suits.
Randy: Nice. Nice. I love those ... I remember ... I'm gonna [inaudible 00:29:58] myself a bit, but one of my favorite celebrity sightings didn't happen in Toronto. But I was young, I think I was like, I don't know. I'm guessing I was 18 years old, and I ran into Topanga at a restaurant. Do you know who I'm talking about?
Anna: Were you just in love?
Randy: I had the biggest Topanga crush, like every guy when they were, Boy Meets World. The one with the Savages, but like Topanga, oh my God. I was in love.
Anna: Where's the spinoff of when Randy meets Topanga?
Randy: I think there's actually a version of it that my kids were watching recently, where they were all grown up, and they were married with kids themselves right now.
Dan: Oh, right on. I wasn't aware [crosstalk 00:30:41] of that. I'll have to check that out.
Randy: I don't know what it's called. Boy Meets, you know. Boy Marries Girl or something. Boy Meets World, is that what the show ... Anyways. Well that's about enough of that. I don't know where this convo's going at this stage, other than pure random.
I think what you can take away from this podcast is that Conex is going to be an amazing collection of great speakers. You heard our top favorites, but in addition to those, we've got Amber Naslund joining us, Tamsen Webster, Caitlin Angeloff from DocuSign, Marcus Sheridan, Carlos Abler from 3M, Joey Coleman, Andrew Davis, Nate Skinner from Pardot. We've got so many great other elements including the Content Feud, which is literally Family Feud brought to life. I'm so excited to welcome everyone to our city and so thankful for the partnership that we have as well with Convince and Convert. Anna, thanks so much for doing this today. Zontee, thank you. Dan, thanks for peeling away from the planning for this hour.
For everyone who's thinking of coming, go checkout Conex.Uberflip.com, get your ticket, and please join us in Toronto August 20th to 22nd. Until next time, thanks so much for tuning into the podcast. This has been The Conex Podcast.
 
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