Should Your PR Firm Be Your Social Business Advisor

The folks at Edelman announced today that they have “Launched Social Business Planning to Help Organizations Create Business Value in a Connected World.”

Amongst the big thinkers, social business is elbowing out social media as the business cause celebre. I even co-wrote a book called The NOW Revolution that is in part devoted to the social business transformation. It’s a very complex issue, but generally the intellectual moorings of social business are:

  • Social is inextricably tied to corporate culture and business structure.
  • Social is about more than marketing, it impacts every corner of the organization.
  • The dividends from being a social organization are just as important internally as they are externally.

I’m all for social business. I believe in it. I chronicle it when I see it. I weigh in on it for my clients on an ad hoc basis. But I don’t provide social business consulting, for two reasons.

First, I don’t think I’m qualified. Despite the fact that I’ve owned five companies and worked with hundreds of brands since 1994, I am not a business management consultant, and do not have the finance and operations credentials (in my estimation) to go there.

Second, I don’t think my clients (many of whom are large companies) want to take complex, transformational, years-to-go-before-we-get-there, this changes everything, reorganize all your people counsel from their social and digital marketing consultant (even a very good one, if I may be so bold).

And that’s the question. Do companies want incredibly serious business advice that impacts the core of their existence from their PR firm? 

I know many of the people in the social business practice at Edelman. They uniformly strike me as a smart bunch. But even though they’ve rolled out an “Edelman Consulting” brand as their business advising division, they are still marketers and social scientists at heart. I looked at the Linkedin profiles of the 8 team members listed in Edelman slide deck about social business released alongside their announcement.

Here are the degrees and first jobs of each:

  • BS Journalism | MS Communications Management | Staff Writer
  • BS Computer Engineering | Management Consultant
  • BA Political Science | MAP Political Science | Manager of Research
  • BS Advertising | MBA Direct Marketing | VP of Marketing
  • BA Business | MS Integrated Marketing Communications | SEO Manager
  • BA Political Science | Vice President, Public Affairs
  • BA Secondary Education | MA Sociology | Event Manager

Edelman First PR Firm To Officially Offer Social Business Consulting Serivces e1323989968646 Should Your PR Firm Be Your Social Business AdvisorEven David Armano – who leads all social/digital globally for Edelman, and is by all accounts a sharp guy – is a graphic designer and creative director by trade and training.

A key point about social business is that it’s not all about marketing but about the entire enterprise (as illustrated on this excerpt from the Edelman slides). If that’s the case, does it makes sense to have a group comprised almost entirely of marketers (and almost entirely devoid of degreed business experts) leading the charge?

If you’re a major corporation that’s convinced you need to make some serious changes to prosper in a rapidly shifting future, do you turn to your PR firm, do you turn to a legacy management consulting firm (Bain, Accenture, McKinsey, Deloitte, et al), or do you turn to one of the new breed of specialist firms (Altimeter, Dachis, et al)?

In Edelman’s case, they have laid a lot of groundwork in the past two years, and have the personnel and the client base to make this work. I think they’ll succeed in re-positioning the firm, and certainly it’s a lot easier to generate project and retainer revenue for your agency when you’re having transformative, long-term conversations with the C-Suite about social business. This move elevates them in the vendor hierarchy.

But what about the other shoe? What happens when second, third, and fourth-tier PR firms, digital agencies, and other flavors of marketing-oriented professional services firm decide that social business is the new ticket to revenue generation and credibility?

Will companies take serious business advice from their agency? Is Edelman the exception that proves the rule, or just the first group to have the unabashed cojones to crash the party?

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JohnPerls 5 pts

Are the lines between ad agencies and pr firms really blurred?

I've heard a number of pr folks talk recently about the murky lines social creates between ad shops and pr firms, but to me, it seems pretty crystal clear. Ad agency personal are trained to speak to consumers, whether it be general advertising or direct response. It's about research, billions of dollars in research, human behavior, brand awareness, brand loyalty, competitive advantages, etc. and ultimately finding that unique insight that does much more than sell. It's about connecting with consumers based on that unique insight and then developing creative that inspires someone to consider a brand more than they would have without us. And that's called marketing. So what's social mean to agency folks? It's a crm platform that launches direct response of the 80s into the stratosphere. I don't buy the line that because social media is earned and not paid it earns pr firms rights to carry the social torch. But let's go easy on pr firms for a second. And let's just say the can carry on a consumer conversation on Facebook or tweats on Twitter. We'll give most firms that. But, what about creating provocative like-gates that entice people to like a page. Is that any different from enticing a consumer to pick up the phone, visit a website or make an online purchase? And what about Facebook application design and development? We're talking sophistication beyond any media to hit the planet since the printing press. I mean, we can create campaigns, launch them and engage with consumers all within a few hours of each other. That's marketing bliss! Yes, pr firms are certainly In a bind. Consumers are becoming more influential than any publication on the face of the planet. 500 million folks on Facebook each day folks. So pr firms are ultimately trying to save themselves. But if they are going to serve their client's well and develop a lasting model, they're going to need to build a different kind of recruitment department that knows what to look for in researchers, planners, media and creative talent. But hey, wait a second, isn't that what the core of an ad agency is?

John Perls

Founder

@CrazyMouseMedia

jasonkeath 7 pts

I don't understand Jay... So you are saying an organization should have expertise and experience in an industry before selling products to their clients in said industry? Boy, that would change things.In all seriousness. It is just as inevitable as every agency (ad, pr, design, digital, et all) getting into social. They will follow the money. And frankly, social media marketers, the good ones, are needed greatly in the conversation. So are the traditional corporate consultants and finance hands. Social media marketers just happen to be the technology and human experts. Ok, done preaching to the choir. Let's regroup this time next year and point out all the agencies doing social business. Will be interesting to watch.

chimoose 7 pts

This is a great post, Jay, as evidenced by the thoughtful comments that span a number of different opinions. As someone who was honored to be featured in "The Now Revolution," there are a few premises in your post with which I thoroughly agree. Chief among them:

- Social business is about much more than PR and Marketing

- Traditional PR agencies, as entities, don't necessarily understand the corporate dynamics necessary to consult on Social Business

A few comments, though, from the vantage point of someone who spent 20 years in corporate (17 in HR) before joining a consultancy:

PR was the first corporate function to begin grasping the power of social - so it's fairly logical that their POV would be the first to permeate the corporation as a whole, and agencies with PR expertise would be the first to consult on what social business might look like.

Business consultancies, on the other hand, typically do NOT understand social, and have been very late to the party ... in fact, many of the biggies are partnering with smaller communications agencies to learn the nuances of what social really means.

Smarter consultancies (and I certainly think Edelman fits this description) understands what they can and cannot do, and are beginning to hire more people who have a radically different profile, and who really understand how corporations really work (cf @zenaweist). That's why someone like me (a corporate guy if there ever was one) is now doing consulting work - and finding that my background and credentials are appealing to my clients.

Thanks again for the great post!

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

chimoose Thanks for the simply fantastic comment. I agree, people like Z bring the holistic corporate background (with social sensibility, natch) that can be a real difference-maker.

NealSchaffer 9 pts

Great thought-provoking post Jay. I have always thought that, since social permeates the entire organization, it would take someone who has managed organizations and worn many different hats to be able to do social business consulting because of this fact. I do believe that the problem with PR agencies going after social is that they are "bending the pipe" to make social fit their business offering. Same goes with SEO firms, web design firms, ad agencies, and the rest of them. Having a pre-existing relationship with their clients will help them get their foot in the door, but because social is not at the strategic core of their offerings, there are bound to be issues that will arise over time.

The only way to provide social business consulting is to be completely dedicated to social, have a track record in social, and be able to truly speak to how social affects all of the different corporate disciplines. Impossible for one person or people from a singular discipline to do - but not impossible for a team who are experienced in social across all of the disciplines coming together to form a new kind of dedicated social media agency offering strategy consulting that we will see emerge in the not-too-distant future.

DaveKerpen 7 pts

Interesting post, Jay and even better discussion! I've struggled with how to best approach social business consulting myself. Many of our @LikeableMedia clients have asked for it, and we've done what we can, mostly as value-added service. But I've felt our social media strategists, community managers, and social designers, as talented as they are at what they do, are simply not qualified for management consulting yet.

Clearly the market is in need of social business consulting though, and whether Edelman, Dachis, IBM, McKinsey or others will best deliver that, well, the market will decide. It's going to be an exciting few years to figure it out.

NathanRKing 5 pts

DaveKerpen@likeablemedia Great point - social strategists, community managers and other similar similar roles are not management consultants. For this to really work, does the management consultant need to expand their role to include social media? At the same time, can a social media strategist learn management consulting? Obviously, neither can just go take a few classes and jump right in. If the market is indeed geared up for social business consulting, maybe these business decisions need to happen through a select committee of both roles.

redslice 6 pts

Great post, Jay. I'm enjoying the lively debate in the comments as well. My take:

1) I feel many agencies within the larger marketing stratosphere take advantage of client confusion about specialities, and simply scream, "Yep, we can help with that, too." Some of them indeed can do it all; most cannot. People are already confused about the different marketing disciplines and leading them astray by saying you can offer something because you know what the acronym stands for is irresponsible. Many clients have come to me saying, "My website developer said they could help me with branding and messaging and I paid a boatload for it and it's horrible." Not saying this is everyone's experience, but there are a few bad apples.

2) I agree that education does not imply expertise. Many people without the right degree are very skilled. You're not saying that . I think your point is if social business does not just impact marketing, but the fundamental culture, operations and infrastructure, then shouldn't those skills be present at the table as well?

I'm sure Edelman's folks are amazingly qualified, given their reputation. What I fear is this being one more encroachment that PR firms try to make - outside of their core competency - just to make money from the latest trends - off the back of a confused client who doesn't know better.

TDefren 5 pts

I wish I'd written this post. I brought up the same issues (with much less depth) on Google+ (https://plus.google.com/u/0/113920684085515272676/...), but @jaybaer (bless you lad) put the time in.

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

TDefrenJayBaer Thanks Todd. I appreciate that very much.

techguerilla 10 pts

Interesting post Jay.

In regards to the issue around degrees, first jobs, etc. Not sure that's particularly relevant. The path of evolution is important since that forms the basis of relevant experience, but the starting point..whether single celled organism or something more fully formed...shouldn't take away from the result. I have some of my deepest conversations in this area with Dave Gray, yet his original background would never stand the kind of scrutiny you're putting forth for example. I came out of the technology arena early on before moving into high end consulting, facilitation and change management. Surely that doesn't mean that my knowledge of business foundations is somehow 'less'?

The diversity of that evolution path is a bonus in my opinion. Armano, Peter Kim, Amber Naslund, Jeremiah Owyang, Dave Gray, etc. all view the world through a slightly different lens that informs and enhances my own.

Can a PR firm successfully sell themselves as a Social Business consultancy? Probably not. Can they delineate an arm of themselves as being separate enough to do so while retaining the power of the existing brand? Yes, I think so. Predominantly because both sides of the fence can act as lead gen tools for the other vs. trying to do a massive separate branding exercise.

My personal take is that clients are all over the map. Some want a pure play that acts as a one-stop shop (Dachis for example), some want a hybrid with a more diverse breadth of skills (Edelman possibly), some want pure play SB strategy without the perceived bias that comes with staffing ground level implementation folks, some want traditional strategy....you get the idea. There's no such thing as a single 'right answer' here. Nor should there be. Client comfort with existing relationships, their own unique needs, the starting point of where Social Business is taking seed (rarely does it start at C-level, even though that would be ideal), etc. all can and do influence the best partner for a particular client.

Just my .02 cents.

Cheers,

Matt Ridings - techguerilla

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

techguerillatechguerilla As with my comment to Chris below, I think you've misread the post, my friend. I did not say (and do not believe) that the Edelman team or anyone else is somehow "less" or unqualified. But I do wonder why if we keep saying social business is about more than marketing, why the majority of its practitioners are from a marketing background (including to some degree, you and me)?

And I agree that diversity of expertise and evolution path is terrific. Yet, I don't think most firms really have that yet, because these social business practices are being spawned by marketers. Pete says in the comments below that Dachis is different in that regard. And they may well be.

I concur that clients are all over the map, especially since they have no idea what they are buying, what it should cost, or what the outcomes might be. This is selling websites circa 1997, but with much higher stakes. Eventually, clients DO figure it out though, and that's when there will be conventional wisdom re: who is best to turn to for this stuff.

techguerilla 10 pts

JayBaer Let me put it this way. Thought leadership is evolving to the same place, but from different fronts. It's why there's always disagreement between folks on trying to distinguish between Enterprise 2.0 and Social Business for example. I think the perception is slightly skewed simply because the circles which you have more visibility into happen to be more marketing oriented. ATOS, Cap Gemini, IBM, etc. all are pushing on this front (from their own perspective). From an application of resources and investment perspective I'd have to say they have as much skin in this game as anyone, they just aren't as visible in the circles that grew out of social media and evolved beyond it. Now, as far as social media is concerned it has been predominantly a Marketing and PR movement. Those early practitioners have evolved and said "I see where this is going, and it's beyond my current scope so I have a decision to make...". Edelman is one example of that, as are others. Because they were housed in a firm interacting with marketers they happened to have some smart people who had moved beyond social media, thus a marketing oriented background. That doesn't mean they don't fully understand the implications and possible solutions. They may inherently have less experience with change management at that scale but that can be hired and/or developed.

But one way to look at is to flip it on its head and say "Does IBM have as much experience with the external facing side of this beast as someone who came from that angle? If not, does that mean their proposed solutions will not be adequate because the implications were not taken into account?"

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

techguerilla JayBaer As to your IBM question, yes. If they were providing externally-facing social business without marketing expertise, I would indeed look at it with a bit of a jaundiced eye. Integration is the key. Of process, and of expertise.

hospitalityfan 7 pts

JayBaertechguerillatechguerilla Mr. Baer, really appreciate your insight regarding your own strengths and opportunities. All great leaders know what their strengths are and understand what they need to do in order to compensate if necessary!

I could not agree more with your post! Anyone who has worked with the different functional areas (eg. Marketing, Finance, Ops, etc.) understands that at a basic level they operate very differently and many times unfortunately have different agendas.

Whether "Your PR Firm Should be Your Social Media Advisor" seems most dependent on the outcome desired by leadership. Love the way you articulate your points!

chris_reed 6 pts

Not sure I entirely agree with the premise of the post, but certainly enjoyed reading the comments. Trying to pigeon-hole people by their academic background is a recipe for disaster, surely?

The agencies/consultancies who are doing the best work in this area (Altimeter, Dachis/Headshift, Edelman, etc) are good because of the diversity of the people there, not the homogeneity of the people who work there.

And are you being deliberately provocative by saying PR agencies will be rubbish at social business, or do you honestly believe it? If so, I think you're underestimating the business consultancy (much of which derives from reputation management advice - which has always had to transcend internal business divisions) that the best PR consultancies (at least in the UK) are already offering?

From my POV, the Edelman announcement was actually just a good publicity-generating tool - a means to package up the work that they (and others) have been doing in this space for some time now. People like armano Britopian and Cybersoc are already well-respected by their peers in this space.

Yes there will be rubbish 'social business' consultants, just as there are totally ridiculous self-proclaimed social media gurus in this space. But to suggest that PR agencies can't perform in this space totally underestimates the work they've been doing already...

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

chris_reedarmanoBritopianCybersoc I don't think I said that PR firms would be rubbish at social business. And I don't necessarily believe that. But I do wonder whether companies will entrust legacy PR firms (Edelman and beyond) with these chores.

Further, with regard to social business, my question is that if we keep saying it's not about marketing, why are so many of the practitioners from a marketing background? I wasn't using educational background to disparage the Edelman team in any way. I know most of them, and they are aces. But they are almost all marketers. Is that what is required for social business design?

I'm not trying to take sides. I really do not know what will become of all of this, and I wanted to talk it out with smart people. I realize Edelman is already doing this work, and doing it well. But as I stated in the conclusion, does that mean that all PR firms are inherently capable of that? And should they aspire to provide those services? Saying that "Edelman and the best of the U.K. are already doing it" is a straw man argument in its purest form.

chris_reed 6 pts

JayBaer Sorry, yes - re-reading your post, in light of this reply, especially the bits in bold make for a stronger narrative/argument.

I reckon we're starting to see a hybrid skillset developing. And those people may well be coming from a business-consultancy perspective, or a comms/marketing perspective. But certainly adopting bits of both.

Either way they'll make social business work when they can solve business problems, using effective (typically new) technologies to forge links in organisations between real people, not just between departments.

Either way - a fine post which has kickstarted a lively discussion.

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

chris_reed Really interesting point Chris about a hybrid skill set. I wonder if Bain and McKinsey are hiring digital marketers and social media people to help them gain the marketing perspective they may not have in the concentration Edelman (and similar) possesses? Anyone have a handle on that? Perhaps chrisheuer is evidence of that?

Mike McGrath 5 pts

JayBaerchris_reedchrisheuer Let's not forget Giovanni Rodriguez, he's at Deloitte as well.

DannyBrown 2290 pts

Great topic and conversation starter, mate.

The biggest thing that stands out for me is whether this needed to be a "news release" at all? Reading the notes at the end of the release, where the outlined features are, then it's something that any good business/practice is already doing, both internally and for their clients.

Knowing many of the Edelman team, there are very smart folks there (looks like we'll be working with the Toronto team imminently). Perhaps the "problem", if you like, is that Edelman is still seen as a very traditional PR agency, while the product they're talking about today falls within the digital field.

By that definition, are Edelman possibly doing themselves a disservice by making it look like something they're just starting to do, as opposed to something their teams have been doing for a while now?

Interesting conversation, looking forward to seeing where it goes.

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

DannyBrown Thanks Danny. Are you guys working in social business design at present, or focused more on social media and less on the internal business workings? Just curious.

DannyBrown 2290 pts

JayBaer It's kinda a mix of both. Our beta offering is a social marketing platform for SMe's, but our long-term model is a bigger stage thing, which really ties SM and social commerce to its natural progression. Scheduled for a Q2 release next year, would love you to have a look nearer the time if interested?

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

DannyBrown Of course. Fire when ready.

Craig Daitch 7 pts

My former colleague, Chris Boudreaux said it best in the November/December edition of Consulting Magazine. "The big [advertising and PR] agencies live and breathe media all day, every day, but they are challenged because achieving business outcomes through social media requires internal changes to business processes, systems integration, and organizational change management - and the agencies don't know how to do these things."

And regarding consulting firms, Chris says, "Comapnies don't need an army of consultants for implementations, so it's hard for the larger consultancies to create offerings that generate significant revenue for them."

Did I mention that prior to joining Converseon, Chris was former Accenture?

From the client side of the world, I can tell all of you with full confidence that I'm agnostic to what name is on the door of the company knocking on mine offering social business solutions. What I care about is who's knocking and the experience they have in change management. If the perception of a CMO is that a PR agency shouldn't be providing the level of organizational restructuring services necessary to develop real business outcomes through social media, then think about how you package your offering. Companies such as RAPP created Cultura - their cultural anthropology arm specifically designed to deflect any concerns over a direct marketing agency getting into the business of "people".

I'm rambling. I suggest reading the article I referenced Chris from. http://www.consultingmag-digital.com/consultingmag...

-Craig Daitch, Digital Communications, Ford Motor Company

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

Craig Daitch Thanks Craig. I'll check out that article, and I'm interested in the positioning of Cultura. Wasn't aware they were going that route at RAPP. Intriguing.

armano 8 pts

Somewhat related to this thread, Matt Dickman recently announced he's joining Weber Shandwick as EVP, Social Business Innovation http://technomarketer.typepad.com/technomarketer/2...

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

armano I saw that. Evidently, Weber is looking to join the party too. Matt is a good dude. I wish him the best.

SteveWoodruff 26 pts

It all seems to boil down to this: can a company evolve, and outgrow its roots? I sure hope so - this is, after all, the NOW Revolution! Perhaps Edelman will be the test case. What I do fear is yet another buzzword to banter about. This is simply about business in a digitally-networked world. Otherwise called reality.

JayBaer 188 pts moderator

SteveWoodruff Thanks for the comment Steve. I would like to believe that "social business" is just the new business as usual. But in practice, it isn't. Becoming social in all corners of the company requires (typically) real shifts in how you view your company internally and externally. Those shifts almost by definition require outside help, because employees are too close to the enterprise to fully appreciate the forest through the trees. The question really is "Who Ya Gonna Call?"

Conversation from Twitter

jaybaer
jaybaer

sebastianvasta Actually, I don't say no. I say it depends. (cc armano)

karenbaglin
karenbaglin

armano Awesome post\/comments! Agree relationships will rule; ideally biz should incorporate social w\/ own peeps who know biz & audience 1\/2

armano
armano

sebastianvasta jaybaer actually, I say it doesn't matter as much as we think. Professional services firms are all blurring svs. these days

sebastianvasta
sebastianvasta

armano I'm with you on this one. More important to understand social technologies and behaviours than to have a certain job title.

armano
armano

sebastianvasta agree 100 percent

triercompany
triercompany

armano Should Your PR Firm Be Your Social Business Advisor - yup!

zenaweist
zenaweist

chimoose really appreciate the shout-out. Agree w ur comment wholeheartedly. @jaybaer's post sprang forth even more great discussion.

jaybaer
jaybaer

zenaweist chimoose Thanks to you both. Hugs and high fives.

chimoose
chimoose

jaybaer Wait - do I get the hug or the high-five? zenaweist

DoctorJones
DoctorJones

edlee ha. You rock

armano
armano

MetalDogConsult aditspt marshmallowgun oh hey!

MetalDogConsult
MetalDogConsult

armano aditspt marshmallowgun Heh heh, yeah, I realized you probably didn't know.

jaybaer
jaybaer

armano Do you think that was the last good year for blogging? I'd say it was the last good year for comments.

armano
armano

jaybaer for comments yes. Congrats on bringing back old school participation.

AndreBisschop
AndreBisschop

jaybaer armano interesting points of view. no blogging no comments... and the other way around...

SocialBizNews_
SocialBizNews_

chris_reed thank you for the comment and mention sir. happy holiday to you!

Britopian
Britopian

chris_reed thank you for the comment and mention sir. happy holiday to you!

chris_reed
chris_reed

Britopian No worries. Keep up the fine work and keep the charlatans at bay... Happy holidays to you and yours...

armano
armano

Britopian mattdickman wow! Big new gig. Congrats.

MattDickman
MattDickman

armano thanks David. Much appreciated!